Jason:

The Buffalo Brews podcast. History because that's what we're talking about before this episode. And history, if you're talking about history in Buffalo, we're talking about Buffalo Brewing Company.

You wouldn't know that it's history because they've only been around since, what, technically 2018?

Craig:

Yeah, they're not that old. I think they're a couple years older than Magic Bear was. Yeah, about 2018 sounds about right.

Jason:

But the roots and the collaboration work and everything, it takes them back many moons. So we're going to be talking today about Buffalo Brewing Company, but I'm going to let you give us the subtle intro into the beer itself because it's one that I've had that I really enjoy. And I think it's a great cap for our series on drinking dessert.

Craig:

Yes. And it could be one of those, I said earlier, almost drinking, it's like a lot of breakfast, dessert for breakfast. So I don't eat a ton of breakfast, and when I do, it's usually like buttered toast or something.

Because when you talk about pancakes and you talk about waffles, I'm just like, I can't eat that first thing in the morning. Yeah, I mean, every now and then, a decadent treat's nice, but who starts their day? I mean, it's a pancake.

And my kids love them. My wife will eat a bunch of them on Saturday. I make banana pancakes every Saturday.

Double, triple batch so I can just heat them up throughout the week is, okay, it's tough. Tough coming up with breakfast for other people seven days a week and- Just putting it out there. The pancake taco.

I like it. Throw a little. But this is punchki, right?

Punchki? That's how I pronounce it.

Jason:

I know there's- That's what other people are saying. There's other people that say it different.

Craig:

Spelled P-A-C-Z-K-I. Right. So I was saying pachki, but punchki is what I've heard, but it's the Punchki Stout Buffalo Brewing Company.

So a very Polish heritage style. I mean, even the crest that he has on his label here. He's definitely had different iterations of kind of like what he goes for, for his, you know, like his logo.

If you look at the majority of his cans, this can has, you know, the- Well, let's just talk about what the beer is actually. It is a American Stout. We'll touch on that in a second, but with raspberry and black currant.

So the can has raspberries, black currants, and donuts. So you know, Italians, we got fried dough. I don't know if you've ever heard of zeppole or spingi, but those are all different fried dough variations.

You know, and I guess this is the Polish puchki. It's basically a jelly donut. Okay.

Looks like a jelly donut. Don't mean to downplay it at all. It's one of those, if you are Polish and you know, you grow up, I mean, here I was talking forever about Nutella, which people were like, yeah, okay, Nutella, let's go.

So like I said, it is all about bringing back your past, your history, and then this one traditions, right?

Jason:

I mean, as we're recording this yesterday was a dingus day.

Craig:

So we were right there in the thick of it. Again, I'm glad I scrolled this away because I think I saw maybe one more can of this available here and he's sold out of it. So you make a small batch or something like this, but it's one of those, you think about it like, oh man, I want to bring a four pack of puchki stout to Easter so that, oh, you brought that and we're actually having puchkis and you know, it's kind of like, you know, king cake for fat Tuesday.

That's the, the, the pastry that people think of. And for some reason I, cause what is fat Tuesday is the start of Lent. Is that?

Okay. So I think that's a part of why, you know, he likes to get this beer out for fat Tuesday. Um, but really this didn't really take off and start moving until Easter.

And then this area of South Buffalo between flying bison doing all of their pints and pierogies events and Buffalo Brewing Company just had a dingus day, a party concert event yesterday. So it's just one of those lot of Irish. So St. Patrick's day is huge in South Buffalo, but then a huge Polish and Polonia contingent. So a lot of Polish traditions and dingus day. I mean, I've heard plenty. I mean, I can't say for sure, but I've heard the rumors that outside of Poland where the largest dingus day, you know, we celebrate dingus day the most outside of Poland.

And you know, we probably do a disservice cause like American, we, we take things and sometimes go over the top and flip it on its ear, go bigger, faster, stronger, but then get away from some of the true essence of it.

Jason:

But I went to my one and only dingus day party a couple of years ago and it is, um, it's, it's a crazy fest for sure.

Craig:

Another, another reason to drink, drink early, with strangers and dance with people. And then women, women have the pussy willows or the men have the pussy willows and then there's squirt guns, squirt guns, there's pussy willows, you go around and if you get hit with a pussy, well, you're supposed to squirt them with squirt. It's one of those, you know, the only thing Italian that I got, was that, can I take a super high?

You know, that's now you're asking, get punched in the face, but the, uh, I mean, Italians always really have outside of your major holidays is St. Joseph's day. Like we have the St. Joseph's table, which is like, Hey, another day to eat your pussy willows and squirt gun. Nope.

It's just food. You know, the other big thing is like around Christmas Eve, we do like the dinner of seven fishes, but Italians, a lot of it's just about what you're eating versus seven fishes. Yeah.

The feast of like the seven fish.

Jason:

I wasn't Catholic. I was brought up Baptist.

Craig:

So that's an Italian Catholic thing. Uh, I just, I remember Christmas Eve. We didn't do it.

We didn't do like the official feast of the seven fishes.

Jason:

We have Christmas and then Christ died on the cross. Three days later, he rose, get a bonnet, you know, like, ah, that's what we got.

Craig:

And we, we just, we ended up eating, there was always shrimp cocktail on my, like some Bacala, which was like cod something and a bunch of things as a kid, you're just like, yeah, I'm not eating any of that. Papa takes more Nutella though. So I mean, Gordon fish sticks.

I mean, I'm all in, but, um, yeah. So, uh, Punschke again, P A C Z K I. So you tell me how it's right.

Jason:

So Punschke is the way I've always learned how to, how to pronounce it could be free to, to each their own. And then my understanding is under the sea is what's called a Sedilla. I had to look that up over here.

It's very popular in the French and Portuguese language, so I don't know where it comes into a Polish word, but, um, yeah, so it's the, it's the, uh, it's the over enunciation of the C then. So, so punch.

Craig:

Yeah. The over pronunciation of C turns a CZK into Punschke. So definitely the ski you get.

Um, but you know, we're again, always on a tangent, um, barely getting started and barely learning the language. What I do like about, um, good old John at Buffalo Brewing is on his labels. He does put a lot of information about the beer.

Jason:

Right. I like that.

Craig:

Let's talk about the base style. You know, we started with a cream ale. We went to the next episode was a sour IPA.

Then we did a Porter's nowhere to stout, but the style is an American stout. So there's English stout, American stout, Imperial stout, but American stout just usually means that little bit more bitterness, like actual hot bitterness, and then definitely some more roast bitterness. So just overall a more robust, bitter stout.

Jason:

Okay.

Craig:

Um, so thank your dark brewed coffee and then there's raspberry and black current. It's obviously raspberry. We had the raspberry jam in the last series.

Raspberry you see in beers a lot, but black current you do not see a ton of, and a black current can be a little polarizing. I can come across pretty tart. Um, you know, sometimes black current comes off as a fault because it just has such a unique flavor.

Um, but then, you know, he lists all the malts. There's pale ale, white wheat, chocolate malt, honey malt, roasted barley, and carafe. Uh, he uses a single hop.

It says U.S. Magnum and, uh, it comes in at 6% ABV and a 35 IBU. That's international bitterness units. So, uh, 35 is got some bitterness, but it's not IPA territory at, you know, you're 45, 50, and then you're sixties and getting into even higher up in the nineties with the double IPAs and people breaking the hundred barrier to just give you a very puckering bitterness.

Jason:

I liked it. It's got a little noted bitterness to it though.

Craig:

Yeah. Hopefully to just balance some of that fruit flavor.

Jason:

And for the record, you haven't had this yet.

Craig:

I have, I don't believe I've had this.

Jason:

Okay. We, we tried it on an earlier episode of the podcast cause we were obsessed with it and we literally drank it and then had black currant punch key and yeah, it was for us, it was a home run.

Craig:

Well, tell me a little bit about that. So when you had the black currant punch key, um, how can you just describe black currant to someone that's never had black currant, like even if it's comparison to another berry.

Jason:

So I also like black currant, uh, liqueur and great. That's great for cocktails. What's that?

Is that cassis cassis? Yeah.

Craig:

Okay.

Jason:

So, um, yeah, that's a, yeah, I would say that'd be the primary one, but we, we try to find things that are kind of new and indifferent. Now look how dark that's pouring out. That's right.

That's really nice. Um, but yeah, uh, black currant it's, uh, for us it's like, it has these really, it's dark. Yeah.

It's stringent, like a dark fruit note to it. Although it's not technically, uh, technically a dark fruit to, so to speak. Um, but I like it because it has a sweetness to it.

Yet at the same time, it's a tart, uh, it's a tart, it has a tart overtone to it as well. But when you put that in, let's say you're making a black currant filling for, you know, punch key. Um, I think that the, that tartness with the sweetness that the sugars that they put in it, I think it's such a combination.

It's such a compliment to each other. And then you're taking that and literally, however they do, I, you know, I doubt that they're just throwing punch keys in the, in the mash when they're making this.

Craig:

I don't know. I think he had a video of him through at least one box of punch key in there. So I think you would have to just for the effect, ceremonial or, you know, just the effect.

But it's, it's, I don't think it's the soul.

Jason:

I think it's more for show. But I have a bottle of black currant liqueur from Meyer distilling. It's out of Ovid, New York on the east side of Seneca Lake.

And I like using it because I think it's just got just enough bite to it to, that makes, um, makes cocktails. It gives it, it gives it a twist that you didn't expect. Um, I'll have to look it up.

Cause I know I, on my computer here, I still have the recipe for the cocktail. I remember that we made with it. I know I still have it.

Craig:

Nice. All right. So that's for, that's for you to dig up and to revisit.

But, um, as I poured this, um, I just got wafts of very just jammy and it does. And that kind of jam that, you know, less jam, more jelly. And, um, it's a dirty joke.

I won't go into about the difference between jam and jelly. But, uh, when I hear jelly, um, you know, jelly is more just a, you know, a thick gelatinous fruit juice that you can now spread where jam usually has the fruit on it, like, like chunks of the fruit. Um, but this has that jelly donut vibe where, you know, you take a bite and it is just this soft, very just, um, piped in kind of, uh, jelly versus a textured, um, jam, so to speak.

So it just has this, like, it just, I mean, the raspberries on there. And then it does like have a nice dark fruit kind of vibe going with it. Um, but definitely, definitely get that red raspberry and it is very prevalent.

The, um, the berry and sweet fruit notes that are coming off of it and it's very pleasing. It very much reminds you of jelly donut filling. And I'm going to jelly donut only because I don't know if I've ever actually had an official, uh, punch key.

So I will have to, uh, draw from my jelly donut, uh, maybe not having Nutella and peanut butter.

Jason:

I thought I was living. Yes.

Craig:

So now we've got, we've got homework. Um, I, uh, I wonder if there are some push keys still out there for the taking. So, um, but nothing, nothing says, uh, you know, breakfast other than a fried dough filled with jelly and dusted with powdered sugar.

So I, uh, I do like the, uh, the aroma and I'm getting ready to, uh, take a sip, but I need to cheers you because you don't want any bad juju. No 11 years of bad luck for no cheers. So good.

Jason:

Wow.

Craig:

Uh, this is a much darker color and then holding it up to the light. I do not get the undertones. See, so you pick up on that bitterness right away.

There is definitely, um, there's definitely a finish of, you know, like a roast coffee, like a dark roast, which is nice. It's not like a super bitter. Um, but if you want to compare that Porter to this, so good.

The, um, Porter had cocoa notes and there was a little like hint of like, Oh, I've been roasted, um, where this is now there's, there's some, you know, he lists that there's the roasted barley on here. It's roasted barley. Isn't even a malt.

It's just, it's barley and it's roasted. That's why it's called that, but it's added to beers for, uh, one helping just with darker color, but I mean, you're going to get that with that chocolate malt anyway, but it's to add the roast. Usually, you know, a lot of, you know, if you Google or if you want to know the difference, like what's the difference between Porter and stout, I'll go into the history and, and, and could bore you.

But usually what it comes down to is stouts have roasted barley. Powders do not. So that roasted barley really just adds that dark roasted coffee, kind of somewhat burnt, burnt, uh, flavor to it.

And I think that that helps balance, like when you smell this and the aroma of this is very sweet, sweet to the nose. And again, does sweet have an aroma? Well, to me, sweet is since it's so jammy and berry forward, usually when you have those flavors and those aromas and berries, they're very ripe, which means very sweet.

So, you know, that tricks your brain into being like, Ooh, this smells very sweet. And by sweet, I just mean it smells jammy and very fruit forward, but you get that on the first to take, but it definitely finishes with that roast bitterness. Now I'm going to go in and try and see if I can delineate and pick out some black currant notes.

And while I do that, if you want to tell your opinion and you're the one that's had a punchki and how, how close it is to this beer.

Jason:

So punchkis themselves are sweeter than this. This has a, this, and I think that's why we liked to eat the punchki with drinking. This was because it was the, a great combination of the sweet and the bite that comes along with this.

There is definitely a bitterness to it, but it is so pleasant because it's such a unique flavor. The cocktail I was talking about was called a Cur Royale, which is, it's what they call creme de cassis, which is black currant liqueur, but in some distilleries like Meijer, theirs isn't a creme de cassis. It is a legit black currant liqueur.

So it's a little harsher. And then mix that in with champagne or in our case Prosecco, cause I'm not going to go buy champagne to put black currant in with it. A little bit of a, a little bit of lemon twist, throw some berries in there, like a black, maybe, maybe a red raspberry, maybe not, not a blackberry, but a red raspberry, something that's going to give it a little contrast.

It's going to absorb a little bit of that alcohol at the same time also. And then, yeah, that's, yeah, that was really fun for us to do.

Craig:

Yeah, you guys too. This is my fun, you know, between these podcasts and the collaborations I get to do, um, like, don't get me wrong. The funnest thing in my life is just playing with my kids and being with my family, but outside of that, people are like, have you been in this restaurant?

Have you done this yet? Have you gone there? And I'm like, listen, if it ain't behind the back of this bar at Magic Bear or in my living room, I haven't really done it too much lately and I'll sneak out and somehow I, I weasel my way into all the new breweries.

It's like, oh, we're going to do this. Well, you know, it's nearby, honey. And, um, you know, God bless my wife.

She, uh, supports me quite a bit, especially for being gluten-free herself. Um, but we, we make our way. I'm like, you know what?

Let's take the kids to exploring more. And the new other half is right next door. And it's like, oh, you're really thinking about yourself again, Craig.

And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I mean, we do not need to go to other half, but they got a kid's menu, honey. And I already, I already vetted this out.

Yeah. And they, they did a nice job at, um, I mean, I went super, it was perfect. They had a, uh, two hot dogs special for $7.

Cause it was a bison's game. I was like, kids love hot dogs. And there's two of them.

I just got that. And it was great.

Jason:

They have a TV that only rival. That's only rivaled by Southern tier.

Craig:

I swear to God, if you haven't been there, go check them out. The new tap room is pretty sweet. Um, but to, to bring us back to Buffalo brewing, you know, they are just a stone's throw away from us here.

And, um, you know, he, he's doing a nice job. He's doing some in-house barbecue now. So you can go there and have some barbecue.

I could see this beer going with, uh, some, some, you know, heavily smoked barbecue. It's got the sweetness and a lot of times barbecue sauce has a, you know, it goes well with berries, the sweetness, but then that roastiness can stand up to a lot of the smoke. Um, but as I, you know, as you were talking about your, uh, uh, you know, previous, uh, encounters with the Putschke, I was kind of just dissecting this beer a little bit with it, especially being my first.

And, you know, I said, I'd come back to it and that was perfect time, but the base style is an American stout. And this is definitely an American stout. It's got that deep roasted vibe to it.

Um, and it just kinda just has this lingering bitterness in a, in a very pleasant way because it kind of, you know, takes on the, um, balancing act that normally, uh, lighter beers have with the malts, uh, and the hops. Uh, so this it's like that roasted bitterness is the balancing act between the sweet, uh, jammy upfront vibes and aroma.

Jason:

One of the things we're talking about that if, if he does this for next year, which I really hope he does, cause it's fun. Uh, and it, and this is a playoff of what you've done because we, you know, we will never drink pumpkin beers the same after you dusted a, a rim for us.

Craig:

Uh, it's life-changing when you do that cinnamon sugar, cocoa sugar rim.

Jason:

So one of the things that we want to play with, if it comes out again next year is we're going to dust the rim with powdered sugar and see how that, if it adds to without eating the donut itself, if it adds to the overall impression of the impression of the China. Yeah.

Craig:

And, um, so, you know, I, I have to bring some Italian to this because, uh, one of my other passions, um, in the beverage world is, uh, Amari or an Amaro.

Jason:

Yep.

Craig:

Yes. I have an entire, entire Amari bar in my basement. So probably about 30 different Amaros and, um, started a little, that's not all of them either.

It's like every, it's almost like making house wine. Like people make their own, but, um, it's a, it's a digestif, it's a bitter Italian liqueur and stuff like, you know, a lot of Swiss and Alpine herbs go into there. Um, but when I'm drinking this and I, I bring that up because the, the black current, you know, brings on some of those vibes of those kind of, um, the type of bitterness that actually kickstarts digestion because, you know, one of the little known things is why Amaro is, is considered an after dinner.

Yeah. It's, it's, it's a bitter liqueur. I mean like the biggest, uh, the biggest one that people might know is like Fernet, uh, Fernet Branca.

So Fernet is a type of an Amaro. Um, but not all Amaros are Fernets. And not all ales are.

Yeah. Not all Pilsner's are.

Jason:

I'm going to get this right.

Craig:

There's all of these family tree things. So, uh, Amaro is the family of bitter liqueurs and a type of Amaro is a Fernet. And, uh, Fernet is like a bigger, bolder, um, you know, a little bit more alcohol, a little, uh, more bitterness.

But I think people have heard of Fernet Branca versus, you know, some other Amari out there like, uh, Averna or, uh, Amaro Nonino, a lot, a lot of good stuff. Some, a lot of times at Italian restaurants, you'll see it on like the dessert menu, there'll be like a list of Amari. Uh, but I do bring it up because that's how this represent Blackcurrant is representing itself to me as it's almost that like medicinal bitterness where, you know, kind of like not so much licorice, but like when you get like to that, that hint, uh, like some bark, uh, like Chincona bark, um, uh, you know, provides some bitterness and, uh, these berries have this just kind of like earthy medicinal kind of like you've been chewing on, you know, the, like just very tannic, I guess I'm trying to go for, I mean, I think Blackcurrants in themselves are very small berries, so you have a, probably like a large seed to a berry ratio. So I'm assuming, cause I've never had just a handful of Blackcurrants and now I feel like that's going to be my life, uh, mission here so that I eat a handful of Blackcurrants. Yeah.

I gotta, you know, I have to back up what I'm saying or else I might just be a blithering fool. I'd have to, I don't know, but yeah, uh, it just, it has like that tannic slight, um, astringent, like I brought up astringent before and I'm, I'm double downing on it. It has that stringency that, um, you know, sometimes like a very tannic red wine might have.

Jason:

Yeah.

Craig:

I feel like Blackcurrant is bringing that very just green earthy tannin to this, which, um, aids the roasted bitterness of the stout to just kind of overall just balance everything. So, you know, kudos to Buffalo Brewing and John, I mean, a very, very nice, um, stout, let alone a Punschke stout.

Jason:

This was fun. We've had a lot of fun with this, uh, when, when it first came out.

Craig:

Yeah. It's just got, it's got a lot going on, you know, from the first whiffs you would think it'd be a lot sweeter. Um, same thing like that.

He's like similar to the hazelnut Porter, you know, so far the sweetest beer is the first one we started with. And I said that wasn't super sweet. Then the next one, you know, we had the peaches and queen, which was the buttercream and peaches sweet, but had a little bit of bitterness.

Then we went to the tears of the goddess carrot cake from Mortalis and that finished with like a hazy IPA vibe to it. So that wasn't, you know, that was a, a wow, man, cream, cheese, frosting, carrot cake finishes. That was balanced personified.

There you go. And then we had the, um, hazelnut Porter from Ellicottville and that was just this nice, subtle cocoa finished. Very nutty, but not very sweet.

Not, not over the top with anything. Um, I still think that hazelnut Porter was the one that could be drink. I would drink the most of it.

Like I would drink a whole can of that. No problem. And, uh, could see myself enjoying that with dessert of this one as well, since it has so much roast bitterness and a little bit of that, um, you know, Cassis black currant kind of bitterness to it.

I feel like that would balance a lot of desserts because you would think that this was a sweet beer based on the sniffing and aroma, but it is a very balanced, um, and definitely leans towards more of a bitter. Um, the astringency doesn't really stick out and I doubt anyone's going to drink this, be like, Oh, it's astringent. Um, it's more just because I got to sound like I'm smart here.

So I, uh, I need to, but I, if you do dissect it and go in there, you're like, okay, there's, there's two things going on on the back end. It is the roasted barley as well as that black currant, um, kind of tannic, uh, bitterness. And I liked the way that those pair in tandem to balance this.

And it does kind of just round everything out. So I do think that this would be another good beer for pairing a dessert with like even just like drinking this with ice cream, it's kind of like adding espresso to your dessert or after dinner ensemble. So it's like, Oh, you know, I have a little like, you know, who doesn't want a little drizzle of, um, strawberry or I should say raspberry.

And then, you know, the sweetness is getting cut by your espresso, just that American style kind of roast. And then, you know, that black currant kind of just adds to it as something to balance things out, tone things down, allow you to have another scoop of ice cream, allow you to, and I'm, I'm sure there's people that have had a punch key with a squirt of whipped cream on top or, you know, throw a scoop of ice cream next to it. Next thing you know, you've got a, you got a whole dessert going on.

Jason:

You know, you make a good point about this because, you know, cooking with cooking with beer is, is another thing altogether. But this is one where if you just put this in a pan and reduce it down, um, probably take you a good 40 minutes to get there. But, uh, this could go really, like you said, really good over ice cream as a reduction sauce.

Craig:

It, it might, it might make it a little, like reducing it might make it quite better. Um, but I could see it being, I definitely, I could, you see a lot of like German chocolate cakes or people that say, Hey, take a chocolate box cake recipe and replace whatever liquid you're putting in there, replace it with a Guinness, right? Or replace it with this.

So I can see taking a cake mix and adding this to it as one of the liquid components.

Jason:

Instead of the, what would you put it in?

Craig:

Like probably a couple of tablespoons of water, right? Yeah. I mean, there's gotta, I mean, I haven't made a cake, uh, let alone from a cake mix in a while.

I think sometimes that maybe there's milk or sometimes, you know, I think there's, there's some sort of liquid. I mean, I know you got some oil that goes in there. I think you got a little water that goes in there.

Cause you do need to get this thing to turn into a batter, right? Um, but if you replace whatever it is with a beer, uh, just, it'll add that extra roast. It's kind of like when people say throw espresso powder into something and it really pops that chocolate brownies.

Jason:

There you go. And, and, and, and you really need a quality espresso to do that. I have been experimenting with different brands of espressos to do that with.

And I have not, I've yet to find one that makes the brownies pop and makes it espresso brownie.

Craig:

Well, I mean, give a shout out to one of our employees is significant. Other than at the Buffalo girl that bakes. Um, she does these beautiful cutout cookies, but Matt who works there, his wife makes these cookies and, um, the cookie I like that she always usually throws on a cookie platter is her mocha chocolate chip, salted mocha chocolate chip.

So it's like chocolate chunks, not an actual chip. Just these big old like thumbnail size chunks. And then you've got a salted on top, but then the cookie itself definitely has some espresso or some sort of cafe vibe to it.

So just one of those things that lends itself really well. So I can, I can definitely see using this and baking of a chocolate cake, reducing it down, might want to add a little bit more, um, sweetener to it. It's just one of those where you're going to just taste it as you go, because that, um, the bitterness from the stout, as well as the black current, it could end up being a little, a little bit of a, a punch key to the face and a punch key to the face.

Jason:

That's right. Yeah. As we close out here, series 11 of barely getting started as is tradition.

Uh, the things that are going on here. So, I mean, here we go. We got to go back to the calendar here because we're talking about this episode, dropping mid June.

So somewhere around.